Screenwriting : Writing Loglines. It's an art unto itself. by Dain F. Turner

i can't stand to do them either but to be honest hate doing synopsis even more

I would almost rather hire someone to do synopsis plus get a different perspective other then my own on my own writing...

I try and put myself on a word limit for loglines. Writing the Synopsis has been challenging as well, so I put myself on a word count limit for that as well. Not that I have actually sold any of my Screenplays yet. I learned quickly how painful the pitching process can be. I write on a Yellow Post It note KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID and tape it to the screen of my lap top, to remind me that less is more. It's more challenging to do, after writing 120 pages and trying to make each act flow into the next.

I seem to write at least a dozen log lines before I find one that works and even then it changes.

I am probably the only one who thinks loglines are useless

Some artists excel at short form and some at long, and often our strength is the source of our weakness. Artistic collaboration, done well, always yields more than the sum of it's parts. An artist who doesn't appreciate their strengths and weaknesses, enhancing the former through training and practice, and mitigating the latter through building a support group and developing coping/overcoming strategies, is an undeveloped talent - sometimes brilliant, but often not. That is why talent must be trained and coached. Unfortunately it is also why so many charlatan trainers and coaches prey upon developing talent.

For newer filmmakers, the exercise of writing a great logline often forces you to bring even more focus to your story. Writing loglines is a worthy tool for multiple reasons!

I love writing loglines. It is cool to write them first as they can lead you like a red line through your story. They keep you focussed. I like writing them, because you have to be honest to yourself and bring your story to the point. If the logline is lame then your story mostly is as well.

I make my logs lyrical, rhythmic - not rap - just easy to read and easy to say: Evelyn Rose can wait to meet her lover, but can't wait to meet her killer. She adores surprises.

Marin, 27 is a little short. 37 is a better number usually. Michael, no one wants a cutesy logline - we want information and plot/character that grabs us. We don't want a rhyming poem or song. If you haven't, check out my webinar on stage 32 on loglines. Or try to find Chris Lockhart's online guide to loglines. Both are great resources for this.

OK. You have me there. What I was trying to say was that I think a logline is not a good way to know if it will be a good story. It could be a good story but does not guarantee it. All this emphasizes on a good logline can be misleading. I think it is silly for somebody to buy a script based on a logline. Would it be a good idea to choose a restaurant based on a logline. I like to get as much information as I can before making a decision but I guess I am strange.

For loglines, Blake Snyder also mentioned using an adverb in each sentence of your logline to punch up each one's "flavor."

I have never heard of an "elevator pitch" before. I am just saying that a logline is not a good indicator of whether a script will be good. I understand in Hollywood that the logline is "not everything it is the only thing". Considering what comes out of Hollywood that might not be such a good idea.

I use a log to generate a business interest in the script. I can't care about how it's going to change, and change it will ...

The nice thing about writing loglines are the ideas that can come from them. Here's one: "A transracial hermaphrodite must fight city hall in order to marry the one he...she loves. The Brooklyn bridge."

lol, yes Dain. Sometimes you can write a logline just on an idea and then begin to write the screenplay.

The general rule is that loglines should be as short and succinct as possible: One or two word description of protagonist, then the inciting incident, the goal and the stakes. And, yes, one will end up writing several versions before hopefully having the logline that will convey the story best.

Thank you for your post. I have major issues with writing loglines. I find writing loglines harder than a screenplay. :D

@Patrick. Yes, writing loglines are difficult, but something I think all writers should try to perfect. Read Harold's post above yours.

Some people still call it "high concept" - your logline, in one sentence, must succeed in getting the person who is reading it to be able to instantly see that picture in their head and make them say "yummy.....give me more!" It's definitely part art/part science. Good luck!

I find it frustrating to write the log line, after writing the Screenplay, because you are trying to narrow it all down. You rack your brain for months, on every scene, in every Act and then, try and squeeze your brain, to put it in a nut shell, without it killing your story line or making it sound lame.

And totally not not necessary. What is this love affair with a log line. It would not make sense to go to a restaurant based on just a sentence. Like wise nobody should buy a car or make any purchase on just a sentence or two. Imagine making a purchase based on a one or two sentence review written by the person who is trying to sell you that item. That is just crazy cakes.

The way you get someone to read your screenplay in the first place: logline. Every single screenplay will be summed up by a logline - but loglines are not the same as "high concept". High concept is story idea as star. The idea itself is so amazing that people will see the movie just based on the idea. Lots of mundane stories out there - with loglines.

I understand that. I am just saying that should not be why somebody reads a screenplay. As I understand people did not like ET based on the logline but that turned out to be a successful movie.

Then why should someone read a screenplay they know nothing about? E.T. was never turned down by anyone. It was an assignment - Spielberg hired Matheson to write the screenplay, based on a subplot from another screenplay he had commissioned. Spielberg was hot, no loglines were required for him to get a screenplay read. I think Columbia read it and thought it wasn't gritty enough, so Spielberg took it "home" to Universal who snapped it up. The reality of being a screenwriter is that it all comes down to loglines - even if you win or place in a contest the first thing someone is going to read is a list of loglines from the contest. Get used to it.

I never said that. Please do not put words it my mouth. What I said was that a screenplay should not be considered good or bad strictly on a log line. That is crazy cakes. I know there are people who think that the log lines are everything. That does not make it so. Excuse me if I actually think for my self.

A logline does not determine if a screenplay is good or bad. It gives you an idea of whether or not you should read the script to then decide if the script is good or bad.

They way things "should" be are not always the way things are. And as Pierre pointed out, no one decides if a screenplay is good or bad strictly on a log line. The log line is what makes a producer either want to read a screenplay or not read it. David, how do YOU decide to pay to watch a movie? Who is in it? The director? The writer? The story? And if there isn't an actor or director or writer you have heard of how do you hear about the story? You don't decide if the movie is good or bad based on hearing the story, but you do decide if it's something that interests you. I think it's great that think you for yourself. But producers read log lines. When you are looking for a screenplay to read and you only have time to read five yet you have 50 then how do YOU decide which five to read? Would you read a log line?

I found this incredibly helpful. Take a look at Christopher Lockhart's article (previously mentioned within this thread) on how to construct a logline: http://www.twoadverbs.com/logline.pdf.

So let me get this straight. The only purpose of a logline is so a producer will read the script? Also to answer your question if I was a producer I would never read a log line. That tells me little to nothing whether I would want to produce that movie

Well, they're not just for producers. So let me get this straight, you really have an irrational dislike for loglines, don't you? So if you were a producer, you would read absolutely every screenplay that turned up regardless of basic story or genre because, well, you don't believe in loglines? Hmmm. You're not going to have the time to produce a screenplay, you'll be too busy reading because you refuse to limit yourself to what you might be interested in. And how are you then going to promote the movie you've just produced? Look up any movie in a TV guide. The little blurb that goes with it is a logline.

David M., I strongly recommend you read Christopher Lockhart's article—I provided the link above. And, sorry, but you're rather making a misguided stand—so to speak. ;) The logline is often the first thing EVERYONE reads before deciding if they wish to further engage your story. It's just the truth; it's reality; it's the industry. By "engage" I mean does it pique their interest—the interest of your peers, friends, family, general audiences, producers, executives, judges, consultants, et cetera. The logline plays a very important role in screenwriting. A logline IS YOUR SCRIPT boiled down to its CORE NARRATIVE. The logline conveys the dramatic story of a screenplay in the most abbreviated manner possible; and usually it is the very first exposure anyone has to your script. You may feel/think differently, but the majority does not. People are incredibly busy. Many do judge the merits of a story based on the logline. Does the logline interest me enough to take the time to read 110 pages or give 90+ minutes of my life to watch something. I make these decisions based on loglines when choosing something to watch on Netflix. No matter how you feel about loglines, you may be expected to create a logline for every script you write. They are sometimes used in screenwriting competitions. They are used for pitching. They are used in query letters. They often are your "elevator pitch." We encourage people to post loglines here on Stage 32 on personal pages to both share work and as a means of self-promotion. You may not like loglines and that's perfectly okay. But you will have to deal with them and be able to write them. Perhaps just consider them a necessary evil. Lol!

Not the ONLY purpose David, but an important one. If you were a producer with 100 scripts to read you wouldn't read a log line to see if the script is of interest to you? If a producer is looking for a comedy it doesn't make sense to read 30 horror scripts. So the logline WOULD tell you something about whether you would want to produce the script or not. I notice you avoided my question about how YOU choose to watch a film. Let's say you're browsing Netflix streaming for a movie to watch. You come across a few but you don't know anyone involved. Do you read the one/two line description to see if it's something you might like to watch? Okay David, you have a deep hatred of the logline. Then never, ever write one. You win! Think for yourself! Stand against the man! You'll show 'em!

Thanks, Beth. That was a great link and follow-up explanation by Beth, and I'd certainly recommend that every writer give it more than a read and take her advice. Without a great logline, your scripts are going to languish in obscurity. If you can't convey your story's purpose in one sentence, you have a serious problem. Unsold/unknown writers already have the deck stacked against them. You are trying to break into the ranks of a professional industry where the supply of quality writers and quality scripts far exceeds the demand. If you can't follow that industry's well-defined standards and practices, you have nada, zero, zilch chances of getting in.

Actually it is a quite rational dislike for log lines. Which I have explained

Based on the number of comments so far; loglines seem to be a perplexing issue for many writers but they need not be so problematical. Some promote certain word count “rules” which seems a little silly to me (I've never read the Rule Book.) I use the term “elevator pitch”quite freely but “logline” works fine with me. When people learn that I'm a Producer (small time), they want to me to read their script. I always tell them that I don't have time to read it right now but what's their logline? Most (nearly all) have no idea what a logline is and they begin to aimlessly babble on about their script. That's when I have an important call that I really must take – pardon me. If you do have a logline that is concise, clear and to the point – I don't count the number of words. I'll ask you a few questions. I don't produce horror or porn and I don't have the financial wherewithal to do FL. I produce shorts, I like comedy but I'll do drama/romance/fantasy/ Si-Fi (maybe)... Just tell me the dam* story – it's not that hard!

Just read it. Its not that D*mn hard either. Nothing says you have to read the whole thing. Just start reading the first page. If it does not hook you go to the next one. Like you said it is not that d@mn hard.

Let me ask you this. Would you read a screen play based on this log line? A man in his 40s comes to the realization that the life he had been living was built on a lie. His only options now is to start life anew or go back living that lie.

David , I don't know who you're asking, but if it's me... I would say no. My reasons are; your logline tells me it's more drama than I like but it doesn't give me a real story line and that it's got to be longer and more involved than a short. That means it's not for me but there may be others out there who would consider it. Experience has taught me to never read a script up front without some idea about what I'm getting into. It has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of your script. I would say I appreciate you presenting your logline – but It's just for me.

I was thinking of middle aged but was not sure if that was descriptive enough. Different people have different ideas of what middle aged means. I like where you are going with that though. To answer your question Doug I was not asking anybody in particular

David, I would have to concur with Doug; and reading the first page wouldn't change my mind. You can not insist someone read your script or part of it. You can only incite, intrigue someone to do so. Forgive me, but as currently written, it doesn't sound like much of a story (even though the script could be great and well-written). This logline is very sparse, vague, and lacks the dramatic elements to allow one to see the real conflict. It really doesn't tell me what it is about? —a 40-something living a lie... Okay? What lie? What specifically is happening? What's at stake? Why should I or an audience care? What's the struggle? Is there something active going on? As Doug said, this has nothing to do with the quality of the script. Give more information at the logline. Is it his job? Is it something in his personal life? Is he finally accepting that he is gay and has to tell his wife and may lose everything? Has he learned that his wife is a notorious killer hiding in suburbia? What is the big lie and what are the ramifications, one way or the other? Give us the drama at the logline. There could be wonderful irony in the story but we have no idea because the logline is currently so vague. Perhaps consider rewriting it. :)

My understanding is that "middle-aged" means 50s. And age isn't the issue here, but rather the lack of description and information about the main character and the plot.

David, I don't really like writing loglines either. Lol! Many don't. But consider how much time and effort you put into crafting your story, your screenplay. It's a disservice to "drop the ball" at the logline. We should take just as much care and effort to craft them as well—they are the "windows" to our stories. Of course, the hard truth is that if you have a lot of trouble writing and constructing the logline, then there may be major issues with the story—we've all been there! If you can't capture your story in one line or two, you could have story or concept problems. But that's a whole different conversation!

I am not insisting on anything. I am just saying that I think there is a better way of reviewing a screenplay other than the log line. I think just reading the first page might be a better approach. Imagine if What about Bob or Back to the Future was not made because of a "poor" log line.

If you were a producer doesn't matter - because you are not one. Producers (actually development execs) are going to decide which screenplays they read based on the logline (or winning the Nicholl). You may hate it, but that doesn't matter because it is reality. So you have to deal with it... or become a producer and fund your own films. The reason why loglines are important is practical - the resulting movie will be sold to the audience with a poster that needs to sum up the story, a trailer that will be exactly 2.5 minutes long and sums up the story and shows the amazing scenes and set pieces in your screenplay, and a 30 second TV spot that sums up the story and gives us a glimpse of those amazing set pieces. Eventually when the film hits cable, guess what the viewer has in order to make the decision to watch your story or someone else's? A logline. Check the menu on your TV for proof. We buy our tickets before we see the movie. Before we hear your brilliant dialogue or experience your great characters or those amazing emotional scenes. We buy our tickets based on "What's it about?" and those 30 second spots and 2.5 minute trailers and the poster. As producer Michael Eisner is famous for saying, If the audience can't figure out the story from an advert on the side of a bus, we aren't going to make it. The audience pays us - and they decide what they want to see... and the only way they can make that decision is the poster and those 30 second TV spots (etc). If your screenplay can't be summed up in an interesting "What's it about?" then there is no way to get people to buy tickets... and maybe the story would have worked better in another medium. As writers, we can write anything - novels, screenplays, short stories, stageplays, etc. We need to match the story to the medium. You can dislike it all you want, but that is the way the business works.

Sure, David, I understand. But, again, you may think/feel that way, but that's not how it usually works—certainly not for aspiring screenwriters. We have much to prove. Many people in decision-making positions are very knowledgable and have been in the industry for some time. They can decipher and judge a story, the writer and the concept all at the logline—and they often do. Plus, the films you cite may or may not have been given the green light based solely on their loglines. There may have been, or probably were, other factors at play. You really can't make general assumptions or exactly know what was happening during a film's inception. :)

David – reading a logline is not reviewing a script. Period, end of discussion. It is simply a pitching tool – think of it as your script's business card.

True, reading a logline is not reviewing a script, per se. But reading a logline does give one a sense, an idea, an opportunity to form a subjective or objective opinion about the screenplay in which the logline represents and conveys. The logline either helps to incite or hinders someone to want to review the script. So, hopefully, it's a well-written "business card" and your concept/script gets a request. :)

I can see both sides of this argument: For busy producers the logline has become a quick way of judging a story to save time. For writers it's tough to summarize all of the details of a 110-120 page script into a couple of sentences. What we're left with is a very basic overall view of the story. Because of this, unfortunately, I do believe some really good stories have been passed over -- and bad ones have been made into bad movies. (but that's another discussion) Here's an example of a logline for one of my stories: Still troubled by the strange disappearance of his beloved wife, a young farmer manages to have himself abducted by aliens and transported to a distant planet where his search for her puts him in league, and at odds, with his captors and other alien species residing in a research facility/zoo. We've got emotions, mystery, who's involved (protags and antags), location, goal, a hint of stakes. But, in giving a limited overview is it enough to attract someone's attention? What we don't see and would turn my logline into a paragraph or synopsis is the details of his character arc, the shift in goals and needs that come into play involving an alien love interest when he finds out his wife is deceased, what his relationships are with the good and bad aliens etc. So, yeah, it's tough to write a logline that we hope will garner a read and hopefully more.

"What we're left with is a very basic overall view of the story. Because of this, unfortunately, I do believe some really good stories have been passed over -- and bad ones have been made into bad movies." Harold, just curious about this statement. Are you implying that bad loglines are responsible for bad stories being made into bad movies?

A logline is nothing more than a brief introduction to a screenplay. No one judges the entire screenplay based on a logline. No movies have ever been made from ONLY a logline. Not producer judges a story based on the logline. A logline either generates interest or it doesn't. I'm a producer. I'm looking for a comedy because I have a fine director who is looking for a comedy and has two fine actors attached who are looking for a comedy. I read loglines because I do want to spend time reading horror or sci-fi or romcom or drama. If I read a logline that interests me I will read and evaluate (judge) the script. If I don't like the script that has nothing to do with the logline. If I like the script I will produce the movie. I'm amazed by how many of you don't understand what a logline is for. If anyone is like David and doesn't want to use a logline to interest producers what would you rather use?

"Harold, just curious about this statement. Are you implying that bad loglines are responsible for bad stories being made into bad movies?" Pierre I am going on a limb here and say no that was not what he was implying. I think he was implying that people could write good log lines about bad stories that are turned into bad movies. I think. I could be wrong. But I am pretty sure he was not implying that bad log lines are responsible for bad stories being made into bad movies. Correct me if I am wrong Harold

I am sorry. I forget where I read it D Marcus but somebody said something like "The log line is not everything it is the only thing." It is almost like people want to be spoon fed. Marcus if you want a comedy isn't that what genres are for?? If you want a comedy you do not need a log line for that. Just look at the genre of the screen play. What would I rather use?? Well that is a good question. I had a friend of mine that read the first sentence of a book and then the last. That was his way of judging if a book was worth reading. I did not like that but it was his way. I will read the first 5 pages and if I realize I am on page 20 then I consider that a good screen play. If on the other hand if I am not hooked before page 5 I will discard it.

Hey David, Yes I think you're right and that's what I meant to ask. The reason behind my question is that I don't believe a movie would be made based on the logline, good or bad and it sounds like Harold was implying that but Harold would need to confirm what he wrote.

Yes, very true; there are lots of factors that bring a screenplay to onscreen fruition—not just a logline. There are different situations and factors to everything—of course. However, often for a spec script from someone new to the industry it may very well start there—get the ball rolling, begin conversations about what is possible. You CAN decipher/decide/determine/surmise what the screenplay/story is about at the logline because the logline captures the CONCEPT. If the concept "isn't for" whomever is reading it, then it could stop right there. David, in "screenwriter utopia" it would be great if all producers or all decision-makers would read the first 5 pages no matter what, but they won't. As lots of us have tried to explain, people are incredibly busy. It just is what it is. Plus, if they are looking for a certain type of film to produce and your logline is for a completely different type; why should they read the script? Everyone has their own opinions and way of doing things. Not to mention the deep sea of available scripts out there battling for attention. Personally, I'd rather dunk my head in a bucket of lime and jump off a cliff than read a Rom-Com, but that's just me. Lol! In terms of loglines and pitching, David, if you would like to talk to someone who works with hundreds of executives from various agencies and production companies, perhaps reach out to Joey Tuccio for any advice. Or perhaps, if you would like the written pitch pdf template files created by Joey, in which the breakdown of what and how an executive would like to hear or read about a script —and a one-sentence logline is front and center— I'd be happy to send them to you. Or you could also email, assistant@stage32.com, to request those files. Those files are great to review because they certainly help to inform any marketing/pitching effort you might do. :)

You've beat this topic to death and you're going nowhere - Doug has left the building.

Hi Patricia. :) I don't know... Just a preference, I guess. Perhaps more of an aversion. I never have cared for them... It's nothing personal, my apologies if I offended anyone. There's been so many bad ones over the years... As a whole, I do find them redundant, derivative, a bit too cutesy at times, too contrived, reductively and ostensibly "feminine." The only one that comes to mind that I did thoroughly enjoy and love was "When Harry Met Sally." And I did like "Enough Said," although one viewing was plenty. I did rent "Trainwreck" and thought it was fun, even though I'm not an Amy Schumer fan. Honestly, it takes a lot of arm wrestling or force or bait to get me to read or watch anything deemed or marketed as "romantic." A Rom-Com certainly won't get me to go to the movie theater. I do enjoy comedy. I much prefer drama/comedies like "Little Miss Sunshine," "Sideways." I'm sorry, Patricia, I avoid Rom-Coms so much that I probably am unable to give you any tangible, constructive observations. Perhaps that is a genre that desperately needs new life. You nail something new and fresh, you probably would make a killing. :)

Oh, Patricia, and I loved "As Good as It Gets." There're definitely some that raise the bar, transcend genre and are just great movies. Perhaps it's casting? Lol!

Well, generally speaking, it's not that Rom-Coms are too feminine, in my humble opinion, it's that they are superficially feminine or some strange idealistic fantasy notion of what it is to think and to exist as a woman. Gender bias is a huge problem in this genre. Male characters are definitely under-developed, limited and stereotyped too. The Rom-Coms that raise the bar are the ones that appeal to everyone—not just marketed to a group of women. That they make everyone laugh and everyone swoon. From what you describe, Patricia, your direction sounds great; the more diverse and authentic the better!

What did you think of Silver Streak or Crossing Delancey? Or have you seen those?? I know that Silver Streak was made with the what if approach. One of my favorites. Apparently somebody was on a train and thought. What if?

I'm back. David, I wouldn't say that bad movies come about because of bad loglines. There are simply too many variables involved to make a movie good or bad -- writing, budget, acting, directing and of course subjectivity -- and the combinations thereof. In general, I do believe that good movies/stories get missed out on because even a good logline was/is not enough to convey the full picture.

Good thread, Dan. A good logline can hook the reader right away.

Sounds good, Patricia. Love and romance are subjective, wonderful things! :) No, I haven't seen "Silver Streak" nor "Crossing Delancey."

@Patricia, The romantic comedy is not dead, but I think it's fair to say that it's currently on life-support. At least 10 of the more than 700 films released last year that I'm aware of were romantic comedies - and that doesn't include the many others that were made-for-TV or went straight to cable or VOD. One thing I have noticed: many of the recent romantic comedies have a strong degree of edginess to them. Hope yours do, too. Good luck, Ms. Z! And yes...loglines...definitely an art unto themselves, but a lot of science is in there, too. Probably more science than art, since it's also 100% a "formula", fellow artists-scientists.

What Bill said about rom-coms... every genre mutates to keep up with the times. These days rom-coms are often more com than rom, with things like TRAINWRECK as a good example. Though it's all about a couple coming together, and breaking apart and coming together again (in 1940s movie lingo: boy meets girl, boy loses girl, boy gets girl back), the focus is on the character and the comedy. And more realistic (that gritty part). The Tom Hanks/Meg Ryan days are over, the Amy Schumer days are here.

Unfortunately comedy is no longer "old school" and has devolved to the point where it's mostly raunch-comedy -- based on sex or body functions. I think the topic of this thread has shifted.

Sorry, I inadvertently shifted the topic with my sharing of my personal opinion about rom-coms... Really, it was meant as a joke, making an-exaggerated-point-about-personal-opinions-and-how-they-effect-story-selection thing — you know, "this isn't for me." But, c'mon, we've beaten the logline discussion to death, haven't we? ;)

To return to topic I'll once again strongly recommend Christopher Lockhart's article. Here's the link once more: http://www.twoadverbs.com/logline.pdf. His article not only gives clear direction and explanation about how to craft loglines and their general purpose, but it also contains pages and pages of logline examples — examples of poorly written loglines too and why and how to make them better. It's helpful, constructive information. :)

You're welcome, Patricia! I'm happy to hear it helped! :)

WOW, I'm really amazed that a topic I posted 7 months ago would inspire so much passion either for, or against the art of log lines. Thank you all for adding your voice to the subject. I used to hate writing log lines and struggled with it for about a year until I felt I had mastered it. Now, I enjoy the challenge. And keep this in mind. When writing a log line, no one is going to know your script better than you. So, would you really like to put your fate in the hands of someone else? I also felt the same about the dreaded synopsis, which some have posted here regarding their dislike for the task. But, I have found that it's better, and easier, to have someone you can bounce a synopsis off of in order to fine tune it. And once you have a synopsis that really tells your story, you're so damned proud you'll strain your arm patting yourself on the back. But if you're up to it, post your log line here and let's take a collective stab at fine tuning it together. I did this little exercise on another film making site and everybody learned a lot.