Composing : Best recorded/virtual instruments for your DAW? by Daniel J. A. Opolot

When you buy full Kontakt it comes with a full set of instruments. I use them and they are OK. The set most higher end composers and studios use continue to be Vienna. It is quite expensive but there are subsets that are more affordable. In fact the symphonic instruments used by the "Kontakt Factory Library" all start with the text "VSL" so I assume they use a subset as well. Short of Vienna, there are various sets of symphonic libraries people use which are all good. One which many like is EWQL. I consulted with some people here last year and decided on "Cinesamples" (which works with Kontakt). It is not cheap either though lower than Vienna. I have a complete orchestra set including all the various percussion elements and the harp. It does occasionally go on discount but the samples will be somewhere between $1500 and $2000 US. I am very impressed with its sound and versatility and it was worth the investment. It has files totaling well over 100 GB and will download though you will need a significant amount of time to do it. In fact, I have backed up the compressed RAR files onto 7 blu-rays (a blu-ray is 25 GB). Keep in mind your software is just the first part. You will for most of the better sample sets need high end hardware as well. At a minimum you will need 32 GB of memory. I couldn't even load the string section in 8 GB. It may fit in 24 GB but if you are adding memory, you might as go for 32 GB. I did the same on my laptop which is no simple task as I had to remove the keyboard to get to the memory :) Then you will need to ask how patient are you for all the samples to load. I am not, so I upgraded to a high end i7 for my laptop and a Xeon for my desktop. I work on Windows 7 64-bit. There are dozen of models for these CPUs. You want to compare them with a standard benchmark called "Passmark". And then either get rid of your hard disk or use it as a secondary drive and keep the OS, Sampler, and all your samples on a SSD. I use a 1 TB Samsung SSD on my desktop and two 1 TB SSDs on my laptop (no hard disk at all). And I never thought I would say this since I am not big into synths, but another set of samples I use is a Yamaha Motif and I did convert some of my older Gigastudio samples to Kontakt such as my Miroslav orchestra and my Dean Dean solo instruments (especially the strings since Cinesamples does not have solo strings quite yet). I have written some classical and jazz pieces which are partly Cinesamples but my current three films (finishing the third film in two weeks today) are all Cinesamples for orchestra. I will be releasing all three scores via an announcement in my profile within the next two or so days.

Hey D.j.a, you might want to check out EastWest's Composer Cloud. It's $30/month and you get a large chunk of the EWQL library. They're the "Gold" versions, which don't include some of the surround mic's, but those versions are still pretty good. If you pay $50/month (and, I think, commit to a year, whereas you can get the other on a month-by-month basis), you can get the "Diamond" versions that include the surrounds. I have to say, for those of us who spent thousands purchasing these libraries before Composer Cloud, it's a little frustrating to see them distributed for $30/month, but, hey, better for you, right? I used the Symphonic library (since replaced with the much better Hollywood series) for the mockups to Spider Man 2, and Sam Raimi actually asked the composer, Chris Young, if it was a real orchestra. So that's not a bad endorsement. And from what I understand, those mockups are studied as part of a film scoring class here in LA. Of course, the libraries themselves aren't enough. You have to work on your mockups skills, which boil down to listening/knowing real orchestras and figuring out how to make the samples sound like the real thing. It's engineering chops, performing chops, and orchestration chops. Good luck! http://www.soundsonline.com/composercloud

I can chime in about this, especially info about the Vienna Symphonic Library(VSL) products. My entire orchestral sample library backbone uses the VSL Special Edition libraries. I have and use for my orchestral template the VSL SE Vol.1 Strings, VSL SE Vol.1 Woodwinds, VSL SE Vol.1 Brass, VSL SE Vol.1 Percussion, and the VSL SE Vol.2 Strings. Now, here's the thing that is advice that all of us will give you from experience trying different orchestral libraries. NO Orchestral Sample Library is PERFECT! None of them. All of them have a trade off somewhere. You'll have to decide WHAT is more important to YOU and only YOU when it comes to spending money from your wallet. My attitude with purchasing sample libraries has always been an attitude that it's an investment. Nothing wrong with just buying music software/plug-ins as an impulse buy either. But usually people that want to get into film scoring, either stick with it as a mere hobby, or they really want to go to the next level professionally with it. Having said all of that, Joel is absolutely correct about Vienna(VSL) libraries used for a top notch professional orchestral sound. BUT, notice I said an orchestral sound. One of the criticisms that people have with VSL, including myself to a very small degree is that VSL sounds classically orchestral, not a Hollywood orchestra. Don't know if that makes sense to your or not. So the hardest struggle people have with the VSL libraries (including myself), is getting your final arrangement to have a little more weight and body. Not that you can't do it with VSL, you can, and I have. But you're certainly going to get that sound easier out of the box with something like EastWest Hollywood Orchestra libraries. But the downside to something like EW Hollywood Orchestra is that you don't ALWAYS need that BIGGER Hollywood sound for your scores. Also, from the myriad of comments I've read online, the biggest gripe people seem to have about the Eastwest software is using the PLAY engine for their orchestral arrangements. I'm not certain if any of the latest updates have made a big improvement or not. But that seems to have a bad reputation from some composers, more so the Mac/OS X users than the Windows OS users. But I don't use PLAY for that, so I can't say from personal experience. As far as NI Kontakt VSL, I actually asked Native Instruments about that VSL library that comes with Kontakt. What I was told by them is that the quality of those VSL samples are not as high of a quality as using an actual VSL library exclusively from VSL. And I can certainly agree, being that I have used the NI Kontakt VSL version, and of course the exclusive VSL SE libraries I bought. The VSL is definitely better in quality and dynamics compared to the Kontakt version. Also keep in mind that the VSL Special Edition versions are CHEAPER than buying the full VSL Section version. The difference however is that they pull out the BEST samples of the full version and put them in the VSL Special Edition versions. Also, the full VSL versions have all of the semitone/halfstep mappings. The VSL SE versions use just wholestep mappings for your instruments. But it's not a problem at all for me using VSL SE, and the sound quality is still stellar. Okay, I know I've already typed too much info already, but I want you to have a well informed decision from what you may be spending your money towards. If you decide to invest in the VSL libraries, and buy the VSL SE instead of the full versions at first, VSL will give you discounts for the full versions when you are ready to buy them, depending on how many of the SE libraries you've bought already. They are still a little pricey compared to some others, but I still love they way they sound overall. And, last thing I have to say, the VSL libraries are not CPU hogs at all. And not to mention, I have yet to see a sample playback engine that is as well put together, as the VSL Instruments Player. VSL has to have just about the most realistic legato transitions for it's sampled instruments you will ever hear from an orchestral sample library. Okay, I've typed too much already; there's more that I can say, but I'll stop. Hope this helps you and some others. - Dana

Dana - great feedback about VSL. I have heard comments before about the 'classical sound'. For me, I much prefer the ability of having a sample library that understands how to sound like a film orchestra on a film sound stage without my having to spend a lot of time 'tweaking' to get that extra special 'sound' I want. I want something that passes over the bar by just scoring an working with some simple MIDI controllers, pedals, and velocities. Aside from one issue I have with the strings (which is my 'thing'), Cinesamples seems to do just that. I just scored a short film in two days (yesterday and today). Cinsamples was my orchestral score, I added synth sounds (especially sound effects) from a Yamaha Motif sample set and couple of other instruments (my Yamaha piano and a nylon guitar from Kontakt Factory). I am very happy with the sounds - so much better than my older Gigastudio samples (incl. Microslav orchestral) which I used for 10 years. I'll post all three short films I scored for the 168 film festival in LA over the last two weeks by the end of the weekend and announce them in my profile. I could not have gotten all three scored if I was spending time with special 'tweaks' of the instruments.

Thank you all for this! I've read your responses and am mulling it over at the moment; much appreciated!!

I thought I would mention another thing that you should also consider, in case you're not aware of this as well D.j.a Opolot Some orchestral libraries are sold as ensemble samples, and some are sold as separate sections for use. As an example, and I'm not endorsing these libraries positively or negatively: Project SAM Symphobia(either version) contains ensemble patches, not separate sections for scoring. In other words, these types of libraries sample multiple sections at the same time to allow you to playback a particular register of notes. For example, with a library like Symphobia, you won't get Violin, Viola, Cello, Trombones, Horns patches separately. What you get are High Strings, Mid Strings, Low Strings, Medium Brass, Low Brass, High Woodwinds Ensemble patches. So with this type of library, when you playback the note C5, it will be playing back Violins+Violas simultaneously playing a C5 together. Or if you want to playback the note A2, you'll be playing back Cellos+ContraBass simultaneously. But you won't be able to playback just the Violins playing a C5, or just the Cellos playing an A2. Reason being that these ensembles are so popular, is because they are already "pre-baked" with the right blend of each section to give you that full "Hollywood" film sound out of the box. Saves you time as a composer to not have to sequence several different string parts, or brass parts to all play the same unison notes. BUT, there will certainly be times as a composer when you will WANT to have the control to play only a single violin section, and nothing else. Or just Trombones, and no Trumpets. Or maybe just the Flute section doubling just the 1st Violins. This scenario isn't possible with an ensemble based library like Symphobia. So just be aware of this when considering your purchase also. - Dana

Thanks for the heads up Dana, I'll be sure to look out for that! I'll definitely want to be buying the separate sections.