On Writing : Neil Gaiman on First Draft vs Last Draft by Geoff Hall

Geoff Hall I like to throw ideas like mud against the wall and clean up the mud in the first draft of a script (rewrite as I go).

It's funny, I get his point, and it's one that many a writer has made throughout the eons, but I have a different approach. I always like the first draft of anything I write to be fairly tight. To accomplish this, I ruminate, organize my notes, outline a bit - albeit not to strictly to allow for the spontaneous discoveries along the way.

I'm the same way, Richard "RB" Botto. After I ruminate and organize my notes/write an outline, I write the first draft, rewriting along the way, then I'll rewrite again after the first draft is done. Rewriting along the way helps me think of scenes, action lines, dialogue, etc.

I'm not one for rewriting along the way. I usually write the first draft, put it away for 2 weeks and then come back to read/edit/rewrite.

But it just goes to show, there's no one size fits all. Whatever works for you, stick with it. Don't let anyone else dictate how it should be done.

Exactly, Richard "RB" Botto. Who knows? One day I might write a feature script without an outline and see what happens.

Richard "RB" Botto I edit as I go, because I read through it and think “that needs changing” or “it would be better if” and there are times when the choreography is just wrong, so I have to change it there and then as it feeds into how I want the story to go further along the way. It’s just how my mind works. As you say, there’s no ‘one size fits all’.

Maurice Vaughan if it works for you, Maurice, why change it.

You're right, Geoff Hall. I'm just curious how a script will turn out if I jump right into it without outlining.

Maurice Vaughan I suppose it depends what you are used to doing. I don’t tend to outline my stories, but my current project I’m doing just that, because I have scenes and story concepts in my head aching to get out. What better way to do it than to use that as an outline/concept/treatment?

The plot is all about letter writing and memory and so all I had was a few paragraphs for some of the letters. It’s set in one house and I know what that house looks like. The story is located historically in the 50s, 70s, 90s and 10s. That brings up ideas about the interior design as well as costume elements and I just had to get that all down, before I started writing anything by way of the screenplay.

Sounds like an interesting concept, Geoff Hall. It's one location, so that'll cut down on the budget. Even though the story takes place in different years, you might be able to find low-priced clothes, props, and décor at thrift stores and online. If you plan on making the film yourself.

I remember hearing a college professor say that there is something to writing by hand. It's almost as if the words are born in your soul and travel through your hand and onto paper. I tried writing my first novel by hand and using a pen. I think there's something to that. Now, I'm like most of you where my first draft is left alone for at least a week or two and then I come back and rewrite - that way, it's morphing with each iteration.

Leonardo Ramirez 2 yes, Leonardo, I have that same connection with my notebook. How are you doing, my friend?

Well said Geoff Hall

I like the thought of having a notebook, Geoff Hall for dotting down ideas. I've become too used to typing them into my laptop. I'm hanging in there, brother. Making lemonade.

This is really good, Geoff! I agree with most of that video -- though the main reason I don't write by hand is that I have terrible handwriting and cramp up very quickly. So my fingers are more at home with a keyboard.

Leonardo Ramirez 2 thanks Leonardo. I can freestyle with a notebook, but if I’m typing I find that typos distract me and I don’t want all my ideas; dialogue, concepts, action sequences and the like to disappear in the formatting.. I use a lot of arrows and scratching out/corrections, which I can’t do on a laptop, which in my mind looks too linear. One of these days I’ll post a photo of all my notebooks, so you can see thre madness that has overtaken my life! ;-)

PS you owe me a Zoom call!

William Joseph Hill I tend to handwrite ideas, but then the serious stuff of a script, it’s all on FD on the laptop. I hate to have to share my notebooks with people!

We need a Jarvis-like interface for mapping this stuff out, Geoff Hall. I would imagine your notebooks are like a map of the human brain on Mountain Dew. I do know I owe you that call, my friend. Life has been a whirlwind lately but I will pay up.

Leonardo Ramirez 2 cool, yes, each notebook is focused on a particular project, but then I have a ‘general’ notebook on the go for ideas that haven’t yet crystallised into anything worth further investigation. I did try using a software programme for the novel, but the different links and themes ended up so small, that I couldn’t see it on screen! Yes, even with a good pair of glasses on!

When I start doing that research, I use the Zoho Notebook app to pull it all together and then notes from my non-digital notebook are transferred to the Zoho App. (I did use Evernote in the past, but their subscription skyrocketed and became unaffordable).

I look forward to our call. Yes, me too. It’s been a very busy year so far; looking after my Mum’s welfare, selling the house and for good measure, just a little distraction on the health front. Never a dull moment!

I remember you using Evernote, Geoff Hall. I’ll have to take a look at Zoho but the more I think about it, the more I want to use physical notebooks. I think it would be neat for grandkids to see after I’m gone. But I plan on living for another hundred years. Lots to do.

Thank you for sharing, Geoff Hall. I LOVE Neil!

Ashley Renee Smith have you watched The Sandman series on TV, Ashley? I’ve loved it and hope for a new series soon.

Leonardo Ramirez 2 I use Zoho Notebook mostly when I’m researching a story and use the webclipper. It’s a great tool for pulling together resources, ideas and concepts.

Geoff Hall, of course! I devoured it as soon as it was released. I also HIGHLY recommend The Sandman audiobook, both part 1 and 2. It's fantastic! Neil does the narration, but the characters are voiced by an A-list cast. And the Netflix Sandman spinoff series, Dead Boy Detectives is also a ton of fun.